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Ladies: Take Care of YOU First in Your Business - $$$$

    • 73 posts
    March 10, 2007 2:55 AM EST

    I actually read all 5 pages of this diatribe...

    First I think a better Topic Title would have been: 

    People: Take Care of YOU First in Your Business - $$$$

     The previous antecdote about the individual not making the paypal payment for your services leaves the impression that you assumed that he did it because you are a woman and that he wouldn`t have hesitated making the payment had you been a man.  Assuming is like stereotyping....

    Most purchases are made when a persons emotions take precedent over their logic.  I get the feeling that DMM works this approach.  "Ladies it`s not your fault you aren`t the success you should be - it`s because all men are hell bent on keeping you in a subservient role."  That ought to get the old emotional juices boiling.... please sign the contract where x marks the spot.

    And I agree with Nikole.... posting links to other boards that require you to register and login is just rude.

    But then again... I`m a man and the root of all evil.

    CraigL... I really gotta quit checking out your profile to see where you are currently posting.

    Pokerman2007-3-10 9:1:0

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    Pokerman It`s not about what you can do... it`s about what you will do! Amateur Poker League Software - Drive Traffic - Add 100,000 Songs to your website - Music Catalog

    • 79 posts
    March 9, 2007 7:50 PM EST

    Hello,

    I am Deb from Washington state. The bulk of my career has been in sales; radio, RV, promotional items, and membership. A good deal of the time I have been the only saleswoman on a sales team. Most of my sales have been to men(car dealers, business owners, husbands of the women selecting the RV`s).

    My observation is that both men and women can haggle, I respect the ones that are looking for a good deal, and handle the ones that attempt to get my products/services for free. Many clients, especially during the radio advertising days would "forget" to pay their account. My job has always included collections, asking for money, getting a good down payment. My experience shows that the consumer that gets everything they can for free is usually the biggest pain, and maybe you really don` t want their business. Just my experience.

    So getting to my real question, if these things-collections, sales, marketing bother someone to a certain degree, why would you put yourself in this position? There are many great jobs / careers / opportunities, for men and women, that pay well and don`t require these skills. I guess that I think a bit differently but then--I am over 50, and a woman.

    Craig, you probably have a point. We are a bit sensitive here, and now I am going to go put on my apron and cook a tasty dinner.

    rvdebby2007-3-10 1:52:14

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    "If you`ve got a frog to swallow, don`t look at it too long. And if you`ve got more than one to swallow, swallow the biggest one first"--Danny Cox

    • 79 posts
    March 10, 2007 12:49 PM EST

    I hear you Nikole. Marketing is fascinating; the twist that we put on our words is powerful.

    I once worked for a company- RV Sales. They decided on a positioning statement, "Your Fun is Our Business". I was beside myself telling them why it was bad. I would never like someone believing that my fun is any of their business at all, and further more I would resent a company that was touting the fact that they were making their fortune off of my endeavor to have a little fun. They stuck with it, without any tools to gage the markets response I have no idea how bad it hurt them...

    A few years later I worked for another company, they too had a positioning statement, "We sell Fun!" I felt better working for that company, and if I was in the market for an RV, you bet I would have checked them out first. Those statements were very similar but very different.

     Of course you have to remember that most marketing is to get the consumer to your business, the rest is up to you, how they are treated, what is the offer, why should I move to take advantage of that offer--hopefully now.

    Oops, my Bon Bons are melting and my soap opera is calling...

    Deb

     

    rvdebby2007-3-10 18:56:12

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    "If you`ve got a frog to swallow, don`t look at it too long. And if you`ve got more than one to swallow, swallow the biggest one first"--Danny Cox

    • 50 posts
    March 8, 2007 4:28 AM EST
    Over the last five years I`ve trained thousands of people in marketing and info-preneuring so it was a pleasant surprise when I got a call last Thursday (one week ago) from one of my "graduates." A terrific guy with an ebullient sense of energy named Gil. He has a really cool product that he`s taken to market and will have on HSN at the end of this month.

    After we got caught up (I met him a little over a year ago in New York) he told me he was putting on a seminar at the end of this month and needed help organizing and pulling it together. He asked me what I would charge to help him out. I told him that I charge $--- for four, one hour consultats - usually once a week - but his event was coming up so soon we would need to do `em twice a week so he`s got everything done in time. He said, "Okay, let`s get started."

    We scheduled a phone meeting for this morning. I told him I would PayPal him for the $--- payment and then once that was taken care of I`d look forward to helping him as much as I possibly could to insure that he has a great event. We hung up the phone and I paypal`d him for the funds. Then I sent reminders on Saturday and Monday.

    This morning he called for our meeting. I told him, "Gil, I really want to help you so you have a great event - but like I said before I need to have you take care of the paypal first and then we can get started and my aim is to give you everything I can so you have a great event."

    He hemmed and hawed a bit. Did I send it to the right email address? Yes. He said he didn`t see it. Then I told him I sent two reminders. He finally admitted he wasn`t online for the last few days. Okay, whatever. I told him let`s reschedule for this afternoon and take care of the PayPal and then we can dig right in.

    He was polite but I almost felt like maybe he thought (maybe I`m wrong - who knows) that because I`m a woman that I wouldn`t bring it up. After all I know a lot of women who get squirmy at the thought of sending out an invoice for work they`ve already done - let alone consults I haven`t provided yet.

    I was polite but firm. There would be no consult without his payment. Sorry - not gonna happen.

    Ladies, keep in mind people will try to push you. They will sing the blues about their finances and try to get you to dicker down your prices. (My experience is that men try to get you to come down on price - women want it all for free)

    When men try to dicker you down in price or push you it`s not necessarily because they can`t afford you. It`s just a business thing - pure and simple. They are pushing you because they want to see how "firm" you are on your prices. Don`t get upset about it - don`t get emotional about it. If you`re the right person for them and they "get" that you`re not budging - they`ll pay you your full rate. If you really sense that they can`t afford it and you need to lower their rate - don`t do it for "free." Tell them you`ll lower the rate if they`ll give you "X" number of referrals or something else that will help you. Make sure that you get a fair exchange of value and take care of you first.

    Btw, Gil paid the PayPal within an hour for the full amount and did an awesome first consult with him yesterday.

    All the best,

    Denise Michaels, Author, "Testosterone-Free Marketing"

    ---
    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 8, 2007 7:00 PM EST

    Hmmmmm.... in 3.5 years on ryze I`ve never had a single woman say that I was belittling her.  Not once.  Now that doesn`t mean that every woman is my ideal customer.  But hey - if you`ve got brass cahunas - knock yourself out.  Not many women grow up with a structural engineer for a mom.  So, I wrote the book I needed to read myself.  Now if you`re done belittling me...

    All the best,

    Denise Michaels, Author, "Testosterone-free Marketing"

    PS:  Curious if marketing mentoring will work for you? Check out how
    mentoring helped one woman increase sales 170% in just three short weeks.
    Go to http://www.ryze.com/posttopic.php?topicid=820690&confid= 2376 then
    connect with me so you can feel more happy and make more money, too.

    ---
    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 9, 2007 4:01 AM EST

    I have a successful marketing mentoring practise and I`ve mentored over 1,200 people in marketing over the last six years - about 40% men and 60% women.  The differences are astounding - in the approach and attitude towards marketing and selling between the genders. 

    It`s not just that it`s coming from a woman`s point of view - the question is why does a woman`s point of view matter?  It`s not about putting bows and daisies on it.  The reason it matters is because a lot of women really have big challenges with marketing and selling.  Look at the statistics with women`s start ups - the numbers in sales are usually much lower for women.  It`s all there in black and white.  Go to a big network marketing conference.  The room is filled with women but the heavy hitters are always the men.  There might be a couple women who have reached the big leagues - but when of 70-80% of the distributors are women?  There`s a big disconnect and I help a lot of women who have challenges with this and don`t know how to bridge the gap.   I get emails and messages daily from women who say, "Thank goodness I found you because I need help.  I suck at marketing and selling."  

    These are challenges that you apparently don`t suffer from.  Now, if you have perfect confidence and no problems with this - I salute you.  But I have huge evidence based on my experience and tons of research I`ve done that shows that for a large number of women - this is true.  If you`re not my ideal customer - that`s fine by me.  It obviously doesn`t appeal to you.  Fine.  But why are you trying to get me to turn my marketing message around to suit you - when you`re not my customer?   I don`t remember asking for your advice.  

    All the best,

    Denise Michaels, Author, "Testosterone-Free Marketing" 

    ---
    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 9, 2007 4:27 AM EST

    Hi Craig:

    thanks for your thoughtful post.  The truth is there are some men who have similar challenges - but my extensive research shows that:

    a)  when you look at generalities it`s something a lot more women deal with than men

    b) traditionally speaking men are generally less likely to ask for help with something that might make them appear to be weak.

    From my point of view - that doesn`t make for a strong target market - so I target towards women 40+ where I`m likely to have a larger number who resonate with what I have to say and will connect with me.

    I`ve met women who are giving away their services and products in droves because they believe that it will come back to them eventually.  It`s the law of Karma.  And maybe it does - but not always in the form of money.  Why?  There are a whole list of reasons why women do this but it all comes back to the fact that many woman see themselves as being a good woman for giving her time and talents away.  They get that nice, warm, fuzzy feeling - but it doesn`t help `em to pay the bills.  After all go to your local library, hospital, school, place of worship, non-profit agency.  Who are the majority of the adult volunteers?  Women. 

    The women who give things away or seriously undercut their prices tell me, "I just want to be nice."  The problem is that in the business world it`s not perceived that way.  The perception is that if you`re giving something away it means you`re brand new (and not as good) or don`t have a lot of customers (and not as good).  They also believe (and I`ve heard this from hundreds of women - I`m not just dreaming it up) that they think it will be easier to market and sell themselves if they`re less expensive.  And, it doesn`t work out that way.  

    In business people figure you get what you pay for and so they often run from someone who is way below market rates because they figure they won`t be as good, as professional. etc.   Once in awhile you might run into a gem of a person whose really good at what they do and has great accolades but are charging less than they should because they`ve had some challenge or something happen in their life and it`s like yard sale prices for a little while.  But that`s the exception and not the rule.

    Every one of the women I mentor during the time we`re working together ends up increasing her prices.  Sometimes a lot.  And with good marketing strategy she always finds she`s in greater demand not less.  They have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money.

    All the best,

    Denise Michaels, Author, "Testosterone-Free Marketing"

    ---
    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 9, 2007 4:55 AM EST

    Here`s an example of the kind of private messages I get.  A lot.  This one just came in this morning.

    My name is ______ ______ and I`m the proud owner of _____ Skincare. We`re still taking our baby steps, but I`m ready to move forward - full speed ahead. I`ve read a few of your posts and to be honest, I feel like you`re talking directly to me. Everything you`ve said seems to ring true to me. I have wonderful products and I`m confident about that, but I`m lacking in self confidence. Honestly, I don`t know exactly what my problem is but I do know that I`m holding myself back.

    My ultimate goal (at this time) is to be able to quit my full time job and be able to work for myself full time. As I`m sure you know, that`s a huge step. Especially since I`m in the middle of building a house, so I can`t exactly take a pay cut. Another large problem for me is that I am clueless about marketing and advertising. I`m afraid of spending loads of money on things that just won`t work for me. I`ve just recently found Ryze, so I`m trying to learn my way around here. I was intrigued by your post, so I thought I should send you a little message.

    Have a great day.

    ---
    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 9, 2007 6:02 AM EST

    And if you still don`t believe it here are comments from people who have done marketing mentoring with me:

    http://www.ryze.com/posttopic.php?topicid=820690&confid= 2376 

     

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    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 9, 2007 6:34 AM EST

    And here`s how a couple women responded to that same post in a different forum:

    http://www.ryze.com/posttopic.php?topicid=820462&confid= 2376

     

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    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 9, 2007 6:56 AM EST

    I didn`t post this originally to discuss my marketing strategy and copy with you.  First off it`s not ad copy - it`s a post.  I posted it to discuss these issues of people who give their work away or don`t charge enough for what they do.  It`s rampant.  And I post things that the women who are in my ideal customer can relate to.  And they do.  If you don`t - that`s fine with me.  I`m not trying to appeal to the entire planet.  Your opinions are valid in your world experience but not to the women who come to me for help.

    I teach both marketing strategy and copywriting and I have plenty of people who`ve built incredibly successful businesses with what they`ve learned from me.   I`ve discussed the premise for my work with lots of professionals from brand strategists and marketers to marketing pyschologists and the women who buy from me and what I`m saying is sound and valid for a very large group of women.  If it`s not for you - I`m fine with that.

    You`re right I didn`t come on this thread to advertise myself - but if someone slams me - you honestly think I`m not going to stand up for my point of view?

    The best way to prove that there`s validity to what I say its to show you there are people responding positively to the exact same messages that you are having a hard time with.  And the best way to do that is post a couple links so it`s in their words, not just mine. 

    I`ve sold thousands of copies of my book to women in 12 countries and have amazing testimonials, I get rave reviews and standing ovations from groups that I speak to, and I get awesome reviews from the people I work with. 

    You said that you were going to stop reading my posts.  That would be just fine with me.

    ---
    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 9, 2007 8:52 AM EST

    Ladies - I`ve looked at your page and I see both of you are from northern California.  Land of empowerment for women.  That`s great and I`m happy for you.  If you feel my message reinforces an "untrue stereotype" then it means you`re totally unaware of millions of women all over the US and billions around the world for whom those words ring soooooooo true. 

    I have clients in:

    Texas, Florida, Missouri, Ohio, Montana, Washington, Minnesota, Hawaii, Wisconsin, Indiana - oh, and Canada and New Zealand.  That`s just at the moment.  Every one of these women have come to me because they started reading my posts and said, "My gosh, it`s like you`re telling me my life story.  You`ve never met me and you`re reading my mind."

    I lived in San Diego for ten years.  I`m sure you must realize their is a difference in attitudes for and about women in Northern California than pretty much anywhere else on Planet Earth.   It`s very difficult to take a person out of where they were raised and their cultural surroundings and help them see things through a different person`s lenses - that comes from different surroundings and environment.  Despite your initial reaction to what I wrote there`s a huge group of women who read it and say, "Yep.  Busted.  That`s me." 

    Additionally, extensive research into how our male and female brains function differently are at play here as well.  Maybe that information has been squelched in a feminist stronghold like San Francisco and Concord, but read "The Female Brain, by Louann Brizedene, MD (published in 2006).  You think what I write is offensive?  You`ll be REALLY jacked out of shape when you read that book - but it`s all based on very scientific research by a woman MD.  And her book is one of dozens I`ve read on Mars-Venus differences between men and women.  To say there are no differences in how women approach their business, marketing and selling is to ignore reality.  Maybe it`s politically correct for you - but I could care less about political correctness.  I care more about helping the people who need and want my help.

    What I`m offering is one way - that I know gets women the results they want with their businesses.  Amazing transformations take place.  I attract the right people to me.  And what they need might be an attitude that you got growing up and totally take for granted.  That`s great for you.  It could be that StartUpNation is loaded with women from N. California and/or who are all empowered and making all the money they want for now.  I`m still too new around here to tell.  But my message inbox doesn`t show that.   

    All the best,

    Denise Michaels, Author, "Testosterone-Free Marketing" 

    ---
    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 9, 2007 10:48 AM EST

    What is a target market?  It`s a generalization about the type of people that will purchase your product or services - based on experience and based on buying patterns. 

    It can be based on demographics - factors like age, income, gender, marital status, geographic area and sometimes race. 

    And it`s also based on psychographics - which are more like attitudes and belief systems.   For example psychographics as seen in buying behavior (the part that market researchers measure) might be that two people have the same income and live in the same city - but one enjoys spending money on travel to exotic places and being an independent entreprenuer because they value that experience.  The other person is into having "the latest" whether it`s cars, clothes, gadgets, etc. and works 50 hours a week in a corporate environment to afford all those things.  Neither one is right or wrong - just different.  Psychographics can also be one person who sees themselves as spiritual and buys a lot of self improvement books and attends seminars.  Another one really isn`t into that and puts their priority on private schools for their kids.  

    So, the factors that make up a target market are factors that may or may not fit you.  If they do fit someone - they look into it a little bit more.  If they don`t fit a particular person they usually just click somewhere else.   

    But a target market is based on assumptions about a group of people - what`s important to them and how that`s reflected in their buying decisions.  If that assumption is wrong for you - fine.

    Your attitudes and belief systems are that you`re in control, you`re confident and you have no problem with charging what you`re worth.  Great!  But it`s not how all women are.  In fact it`s not how millions of women are.  So, I guess that means if you went to Borders or Barnes & Noble you`d buy different books from someone else because they`re not written with you in mind.  Same thing.  But you probably wouldn`t be "offended" by the fact that those books are on the shelf. 

    Is it even conceivable to you that there are women out there who have started businesses and then realize they need help in these areas in addition to marketing and selling?   

    ---
    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 9, 2007 1:01 PM EST

    In "Why Men Earn More" by Warren Farrell, Ph.D., 2006, (who`s written numerous books on differences between men and women) he says that based on studies 80-90% of women never negotiate starting salaries before they start a new job.  I.e., they don`t ask for what they`re worth in the marketplace.

    The reason most likely given in surveys about why women don`t negotiate, "I don`t want to upset the applecart.  I want to be nice." 

    Right now the salary gap between men and women in the business world is about at 20%. 

    Further studies reveal when a person is a good or even decent negotiator on their own behalf - how much does that improve their starting salary?  By about 20%.  So a great deal of the discrepancy in salaries between men and women at the beginning of a job have to do with whether a person negotiates or not. 

    His advice to women, "If you`re not negotiating - learn how to." 

    Additionally, I don`t remember the numbers but a preponderance of men are willing to go to their boss and ask for more compared to women willing to be that assertive.  This was based on studies with thousands of people.  The primary reason women give - because they believe that if they`re good at their job they will be noticed and that will be rewarded.

    These same behaviors in the corporate world can be found in the entreprenuerial world. 

    Folks, I didn`t make any of this up.

    ---
    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 9, 2007 1:51 PM EST

    mural2jour wrote:

    (snip) "...but as a woman in business I find that you are treated as well as you expect to be treated. I refuse to dwell on the exceptions because that is their problem, not mine." (snip)

    DMM:  You`re exactly right - you ARE treated as well as you expect.  Self confidence and belief in yourself are every bit as important as having a great product or service and knowing what to do to get the word out.  We`re in agreement there - and that`s really the premise of my book - to bring the two together.  Because marketing is all about:

    *  Listening

    *  Building relationships

    *  Solving problems

    and men and women do these three things in very different ways.

    You`re not worried about the "exception to the rule" which is fine for you - but I have found it`s an important target group of women and one that truly wants and needs what I have because no one else is addressing them - and they number in the millions.  They are starting businesses - but in a way - they`re almost like forgotten women.  And even though I generally find women 40+ are my ideal customer I`ve also found a lot of women in their 20s and 30s are holding themselves back from success in their business, shying away from charging what they`re worth and very uncomfortable about getting the word out.

    All the best,

    Denise Michaels, Author, "Testosterone-Free Marketing"

    ---
    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 9, 2007 8:20 PM EST

    Hi Craig:

    Because you`re not familiar with Farrell`s book methinks you`re oversimplifying a bit.  Actually "Why Men Earn More" lists about 25 factors that lead to a discrepancy in income.  The negotiating thing is just one of those 25 factors.  And as you say - when things are measured on a par - there are a lot of women who do earn as much if not more.  I only brought out that one particular factoid because it most closely supported my extensive experience of a lot of women who don`t ask for what they`re worth in their business as well.

    From, as you say, taking time off for family needs, to more career changes and picking kinds of work that doesn`t pay as much - careers working with children for example - do what you love and the money will come (um - not all the time) all these factors work together to result in women earning less.  But when compared apples to apples (and when a woman negotiates) there are a lot of instances when women earn as much if not more.  Taken in a larger context - not so much.

    All the best,

    Denise Michaels, Author, "Testosterone-Free Marketing"

    ---
    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 9, 2007 8:29 PM EST

    Hi Deb:

    I would tend to agree with you - the people who want everything free or even want everything for cheap, cheap, cheap - usually are the people who turn out to be a pain in the neck.  My solution:  refer them to the competition. 

    You certainly ask a valid question about why would these women want to start a business when they don`t want to handle things like negotiating, marketing, collections, etc.?  There are an awful lot of people these days who are starting businesses for what I think are all the wrong reasons.  They are not starting a business because they have a passion for creating an enterprise.  They are starting a business because they want to get away from their job to:  stay home with kids, get away from a jerky boss, get away from office politics.  Working from home affords all those things - however it requires a lot more to have a business where customers say "yes."

    Those people who start a business because they want to develop an enterprise have such a passion for their business and what they want to create that they are willing to suck it up and do what it takes to move forward.   

    All the best,

    Denise Michaels, Author, "Testosterone-Free Marketing`  

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    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 9, 2007 8:48 PM EST

    CraigL wrote:

    (snip)  "My only point is that there`s NO difference between men and women, other than reproductive capacity and function. (snip)

    DMM:  You gotta be kidding, Craig!!!  Aw c`mon, you`re a lot smarter than that.  You`re still believing that feminist drivel from the 1980s and 90s that`s been proven untrue by study after study after study.  Oh maybe not, because the feminists have been pushing down that information for years now trying to maintain the politically correct status quo - even if it doesn`t represent the truth.

    I`m not saying I don`t appreciate what feminists did back in the days when women couldn`t get certain jobs, buy a house or other rights we take for granted now.  I`m 49 and I could tell you stories.  But to say the only differences are reproductive is to ignore reality and the significant science of the last ten years.  And I`m not saying that those differences make us better or worse - just different - and the differences are very significant.

    CraigL "I could care less if there have been billions of years of oppression toward women, men, geese, or feta cheese. What YOU are doing TODAY is what matters. If you feel oppressed, be independent and assertive, or as someone said, "Butch up!" If you feel there are stereotypes, don`t use them." (snip)

    DMM:  Yep, you`re absolutely right - because where you`re at right now - is where you`re at - you start from there.  Though, I`d like to see that oppression towards feta cheese.  

    To not take responsibility of course means to remain a victim.  I`m not suggesting that anyone stay in a victim role - because when you do that - you give your power away.  Not so good.  On the other hand to just say "Butch up!" is to oversimplify and diss the power of those feelings and emotions in a testosterone-heavy way.  And Craig, while I believe your intentions truly are good - it`s just not that helpful to affect real change for women who are feeling behind the 8-ball.  (That`s why the last chapter of my book is for men who want to be more supportive of the women in their lives - wives, girlfriends, sister, mom, business partner, friend - in a way that works for women.) 

    All the best,

    Denise Michaels, Author, "Testosterone-Free Marketing`

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    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 9, 2007 9:10 PM EST
    Erin wrote: 

    "Thank you for your post, it "spoke" to me. I also was not offended. I do not consider myself weak, sometimes folks take niceness for either stupidity or that they can walk all over you. I have been learning to create a line between niceness and firmness. I have had situations with men that you mentioned and women. I also have clients that respect that i run a business but when i get the folks that want free, free, free..i have sometimes felt uncomfortable and am learning to be more firm. I have been a success both personally and professionally but have always had issues with asking for payment. Thanks for your post it was appreciated:)."

    DMM:  Thanks for your kind words as they are greatly appreciated.  I`ve met a lot of women who are strong in a lot of ways.  They are strong partners to the people they love, they are strong when it comes to their family and home, they are strong when it comes to doing what they do  - and doing it well.  And they might be socially outgoing and friendly.  No wallflower here. 

    But doggone it there`s something about selling and marketing that makes them squidgy. 

    And it`s really important to have healthy boundaries.  You can be polite and pleasant and still hold your ground.

    Many many women grow up with a steady diet of hearing:

    *  Don`t toot your own horn

    *  Be a nice girl

    *  Let everyone else go first

    *  And for goodness sake - don`t call the boy.

    Last month I gave a talk in front of the Las Vegas Women`s Realtor Council - there were 150 women Realtors in attendance.  I asked them to put their hands up if they heard at least two of these statements growing up.  By the time I said all five - every hand in the room was up.

    The problem is when you start a business you`re told:

    *  You gotta toot your own horn

    *  You can`t take "no" for an answer

    *  You should position yourself as the expert or the authority

    *  You need to call, call, call.  Or connect, connect, connect - depending on the kind of business you have.

    Something feels "off" because in effect we`re being told that we basically have to be 180 degrees different from how we were raised and conditioned.  And it`s on an almost imperceptible level but many women have told me they feel like a brazen hussy, a barracuda and a b*tch trying to pick up the phone and call a lead they met a few days before at a networking meeting.  Of course - they were trained that nice girls don`t call.  What I do is help them learn to make different conscious choices rather than react from that automatic knee-jerk conditioning so they can do the the things that have felt uncomfortable - combined with good marketing strategy and tactics - so that they can have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money.

    Is it for everyone?  Of course not.  But there are women like Erin who connect with what I say - and manyothers - for whom it`s perfect.

    All the best,

    Denise Michaels, Author, "Testosterone-Free Marketing"

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    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 10, 2007 4:26 AM EST

    Boy Pokerman - you really didn`t read my posts.

    I don`t think men are "the enemy" at all.  If you read over my posts and the posts of most of the people who contributed to this thread - I don`t think there`s a single place where men are maligned.  Getting your exercize jumping to conclusions this morning?

    The instances I`m talking about (and after all these posts I find it surprising that you didn`t notice this) are instances where women hold themselves back.  We have met the enemy and she is us. 

    In the initial post Gil indeed didn`t pay me on time (and I know him well enough to know he has the money).  I`ll never know if it was a conscious or subconscious thing to try and slide on the payment - all I know is what happened.  I also know women in my teleclasses and the women I mentor - when someone really tries to dicker them down on their prices - the majority of the time - it`s likely to be a man.  I`m not blaming the men.  Go back to my original post on page one.  All they`re doing is making sure they get the best price possible.  It`s smart business - but I was suggesting that we shouldn`t cave in so fast in the interest of "being nice."  And in a later post I quote author Warren Farrell Ph.D. who suggest that women - who very often don`t negotiate - should learn to do so.

    Yes, there are rural pockets in this country where the old boys network still has a stronghold on business and women are shut out - but those areas are fewer and farther in-between.  I`m thinking of my friend Rebecca - a dynamic, very sharp woman who married a man last year who lives in rural Louisiana.  She`s going stir crazy with boredom and has been totally unable to break into business there - so she comes back to Las Vegas here - does a ton of business for a couple weeks - and then goes back to that sleepy berg down south.  (She claims the area is both sexist and racist and I hope she`s able to convince her new hubby to move here or at least another city.)

    To Craig:  The science about women using both sides of the brain is due to the differences in our brain connections and synapses.  The corpus callosum is a band of tissue between both hemispheres of the brain and in women it`s about 10% larger so there are more signals firing across the hemispheres.  Additionally science reveals that women have more connections within each hemisphere so there are more signals firing for women within each hemisphere, too.  So one attendee at a workshop summed it up by saying, "Oh, so our brains are like a bowl of pasta and theirs are more like an Eggo waffle."  Kinda.  The most obvious result of this is that women are better multi-taskers than men.  This has been proven in studies where women and men were given a bunch of different tasks to complete in a very limited time - and the women all completed them and the men did not.

    I recently heard someone say much younger men these days have picked up these multi-tasking abilities and have developed the ability to do so due to the crazy multi-demands of the world we live in and the more expanded roles of men at work and at home - so it certainly can be learned by men.  But in the past it wasn`t necessary so men didn`t learn it.  I haven`t seen any evidence that this is true yet - but I`m on the lookout.  An article.  A study.  Something.  People constantly send me info about differences between men and women - so I`m sure something will come to light eventually.

    Yes, obviously women have the ability to run an engineering firm or run a nation if they want to and develop the skills and experience.  The thing is many, many women were raised to be wives and moms and maybe employees but certainly not an out-there, confident business owner.  If you`re reading this and you were raised with that level of confidence and can-do spirit consider yourself fortunate.  There are millions of your sisters across the US and around the world that were not and so they have personal obstacles to overcome to get there.  It`s both nature and nurture and conditioning can be changed if a woman makes a conscious choice to do so - I`m simply providing a solution for those women who want to do so.

    All the best,

    Denise Michaels, Author, "Testosterone-Free Marketing"

    Get the book at http://www.tfmbook.com  

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    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 10, 2007 7:45 AM EST

    Nikole:

    Start paying attention to marketing, advertising and selling in a more detached, Zen kind of way and you`ll see that much of it stems from the basic premise that people have problems and they are looking for solutions to those problems.

    It can be the problem of wanting whiter teeth and fresher breath, a faster internet connection, a better website, a more fit body.  None of those things would be necessary if people were not dis-satisfied with what they currently have. 

    Look at the commercials for Apple computers with the PC and the Mac guy.  They`re pointing out problems with PCs and particularly their newly launched operating system, Vista.  They`re doing it in an amusing way - but it`s still pointing out problems - and then offering solutions. 

    Problem - solution.  I`m not kicking anyone down - I`m empathizing with where they already happen to be.  And Nikole - you`re soooooo not there that you see it as kicking down.  Once again - it goes back to the fact that you don`t fit the profile of my ideal customer.  That`s why my words don`t resonate with you.

    I find it amazing - you don`t understand my customer, her issues and concerns, what I offer and the benefits - but you continue pushing me to change my copy to suit you - someone who is not my ideal customer. 

    All the best,

    Denise Michaels, Author, "Testosterone-Free Marketing"

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    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 10, 2007 1:22 PM EST

    Nikole wrote:

    (snip) "(Most women`s fitness commercials are now about feeling fit and strong ... they don`t tell you that you are a fat slob and need a gym membership.)"  (snip)

    DMM:  Of course not but weight loss programs like NutraSystem, Jenny Craig and other diet products show both the "before" and "after" picture.  Because as much as the people who are overweight want the after  -  right now they relate to the before.  (I`ve lost a lot of weight in the last few years so I also have personal experience with this.)

    Gyms are a little different matter because they often attract more people who are not fat by any means - but they want to get even better.

    All the best,

    Denise Michaels, Author, "Testosterone-Free Marketing"

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    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 11, 2007 10:20 AM EDT
    You`re hilarious, Craig. 

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    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 50 posts
    March 11, 2007 1:01 PM EDT

    Hi Jeff:

    I apologize for that.  I think this was my third thread since I became a member at SuN less than a week now.  I wasn`t entirely sure where it belonged.  With subsequent threads I`m trying to put them in forums that make sense. 

    All the best,

    Denise Michaels, Author, `Testosterone-Free Marketing`

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    PS: Does the thought of marketing drive you to chocolate? I`m looking for a very special woman who loves her business but hates selling and marketing. Tell me about your business and your challenges and I`ll tell you how I can help you have more fun, feel more confident and make a lot more money. All my marketing mentoring clients get results. Visit me at http://www.MentoringwithDenise.com

    • 621 posts
    March 9, 2007 5:10 PM EST

    DeniseMM

    Thank you for your post, it "spoke" to me. I also was not offended. I do not consider myself weak, sometimes folks take niceness for either stupidity or that they can walk all over you. I have been learning to create a line between niceness and firmness. I have had situations with men that you mentioned and women. I also have clients that respect that i run a business but when i get the folks that want free, free, free..i have sometimes felt uncomfortable and am learning to be more firm. I have been a success both personally and professionally but have always had issues with asking for payment. Thanks for your post it was appreciated:).

    Erin

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