Forums: Discussions for entrepreneurs and small business.

Have you ever landed on a web site, where things look odd? perhaps, things don`t line up correctly or everything collapsed. And you are saying to yourself "How is this person supposed to make money when his web site looks awful...

Listen Up! sometimes it is not the designer`s fault that things don`t display correctly, 95 percent of the time is because end users don`t take the time to update their computers [web browsers] to be more specific.
What can we do "As designers/ developer" to tell the whole world "EVERYONE NEEDS TO UPDATE THEIR WEB BROWSERS"

Although, it is ethical to provide your client with a well designed web site, at what point, or how do you tell everyone that the web site does not support IE5 or IE4 for that matter. Are all designers /developers still supporting IE4 and IE5 tags?

My question to you is:
Who`s responsibility is it, for your web site to display properly?
Is it the customers? Do they have to be more responsible with the changes in technology?
Is it the Designers? Does he/she need not to be on the edge? What I mean by this is that most designers and developers "not by choice" are always looking for ways to expand their horizons in the art of web design.

For the past 7 years, we`ve been pushing web design in the same path and to it`s maximum potential. Once we found out that we could take tables and bend them and shape them into design. Although, we were allowed to change their shape, this was only allowed in groups. But that was a thing of the past, (not to knock-down on tables, they are still useful)

Then came, CSS/ Table-less designs: As web browsers progress and become more interactive, so do developer and designers and in oder for them to stay on top of their competition they need to stay on top of their skills.
So why is it that even with all these advancements in technology. We are still limited! Is it safe to say that we are limited by choice?

So how do we over come that barrier Customers Vs. Developers?
If we still limited, what is your back up plan to stay ahead of your competition? Would it be wise to have three different web formats? Or are we going to travel back to 1999 when everyone had two choices. A Flash Copy [for the people that had flash support] and an HTML format for the people that were lazy and didn`t update their web browsers?
What is your approach as a business owner? As an Entrepreneur? as a SUNNY?




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Edgar Monroy
Web Developer / Owner / Consultant
When starting your own business the need to "know-how" is greater than money!
http://www.nuevolution.net

If a designer/developer tests the site on the main browsers, it should display fine. Those "main" browsers, I think are pretty well defined in market literature. Yes, a few people may be using IE 4 or even IE 5, but how many? Statistics are available. On the other hand, if the site doesn`t display well on IE 6, then it`s poor design.

If the site doesn`t even work on FireFox, that`s also the designer`s fault (responsibility). Clients are responsible for the text content, and their images. They`re not at all responsible for the design, excepting if they strongly interfere in such things as layout "ideas," color schemes, and menu button titles. That would have to be *strong* interference, as in they refuse to pay unless the developer puts those red letters on top of a bright green button menu. :-)

Look at your stats and tell me honestly how many of your users are on IE4 or IE5.

Hee hee.  This is a pet peeve of mine - I find it so ridiculous to make five different style sheets.  Okay, that`s an exaggeration...three sheets, then...But you get my meaning.  What a waste of time.
I get lots of Safari users, tho. 
I see designers and developers coming together and abiding by a standard that all browsers don`t abide by.  It`s sad really when humans opt to conform more readily than an industry.

You`d be amazed how many people are still in the trenches...


-------------------------

Edgar Monroy
Web Developer / Owner / Consultant
When starting your own business the need to "know-how" is greater than money!
http://www.nuevolution.net

Browser compatability comes down to a few things.
1. What is your designers level of understanding?
2. Is he following w3c.org`s html standards
3. Is he testing the web site on multiple broswers as he develops or is he just concerned with Internet Explorer?

From my own personal experience I`ve found out that if things display correctly on Mozilla, nine times out of ten, the web site will display well on Opera, Safari for Mac and Safari for Windows. As for Internet Explorer, you always run into the 3 pixel job to the right bug. So there is no need to create extra CSS sheets, you can simply include your hacks in one Style Sheet.


-------------------------

Edgar Monroy
Web Developer / Owner / Consultant
When starting your own business the need to "know-how" is greater than money!
http://www.nuevolution.net

I make separate style sheets because I tend to be over organized and feel that it is easier for anyone, including myself, that might need to sift through the files at a later date.  Especially since I mostly code for a CMS that has several other optional css files that I reference in the same location.
I design for Mozilla first, then go to IE, and always validate as I go.

You can still use one sheet..Especially if you are over organized.. using comments
/****** IE HACKS HERE ***********/
Should help you organize your CSS sheets. Also, it is not a bad idea to comment on your style sheets. I`ve founded easier for me to find stuff within my own Style sheets, especially after not working on a web site for a long time, I have to keep notes so I know what styles what font and what are image drivers.




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Edgar Monroy
Web Developer / Owner / Consultant
When starting your own business the need to "know-how" is greater than money!
http://www.nuevolution.net

 I usually differentiate the positioning css from the style css with commenting (I don`t mix). 
But it all works out the same way in the end.  In my line, I often have to go through other peoples code and change or correct things.

what do you mean you don`t mix? the IE hacks or not huge hacks 3 lines at most.. and if you do that on your css sheets top line when you first start your coding, you avoid all the hassle.




-------------------------

Edgar Monroy
Web Developer / Owner / Consultant
When starting your own business the need to "know-how" is greater than money!
http://www.nuevolution.net