Forums: Discussions for entrepreneurs and small business.

Part of my buiness model is a web development service called Nothing Like it Media. The aim is to provide cost effective marketing via the web for businesses. When  I first started I thought I could stop at simple front end web design, but when I introduced myself on another forum back in 2005 some of the forum posters indicated "People just don`t pay for simple websites anymore," And "There are kits that offer people what you`re doing"

So after taking my lumps there I`ve been trying to figure out what to offer or what people will pay for in the realm of small business web design and development. There are so many options: businesses can design it themselves, They can buy a website builder package, or they can get thier cousin to do it for cheap. So my main question is.

When would you all call the professionals to handle your web design (frontend) or web development (shopping carts) needs?

-------------------------

Follow the journey of Marvin Hawkins Visual Concepts and Nothing Like It Games at http://gamerdeveloper.blogspot.com/

For me, I will need it all done.  I don`t know anything about webpage design and don`t care to learn.  I`d be looking for the whole package....and more.  A one-stop shop for all my on-line needs. 

-------------------------

Travis Tschepen
Hibachi Bros. LLC

--My goal in life is to be as good of a person my dog already thinks I am.--

Cartess has written about how he does things, and without going into detail, I think talks about what all small businesses want.

In one of his posts he talks about waking up with an idea. Say it`s a set of bottles he found cheap that he can sell for something. He calls up "his Web guy," tells him he needs a site that`ll show off these bottles. Two days later, he`s got a site all set up where all Cartess has to do is put in some content.

There are two very different components to this, and people continue to just gloss over the content part! Yes, anyone can build a better template model. Yes, anyone can build a simpler way to insert Web objects, build a site, and fill it with something.

But it`s the content that matters! I remember a funny thing about the "any key." Software manuals and dialog boxes routinely say, "Press Any Key to Continue." Tech support gets calls all the time, "Where`s the `any key?`"

There was a second key that many computer-users would like. It`s the "Do what I meant to Do" key.

Everyone would love to have a great Web site. But few people consider that what they SAY on the site is more important than what it looks like. They want to call someone up and say, "Here`s sorta kinda maybe what I`d like to say, vaguely in my mind, on my site. Could you somehow make that into something interesting?"

It`s the "Say what I meant to say, not what I actually said" function. :-) If you can do that, you`ll make billions.

How about an interview form. You ask 20 question, the person fills it out, and the software (and those magical Algorithms!) turns the responses into 250 words of content. :-) Would that be possible?

if the job was so big that i couldn`t do it myself, but i`m a computer geek. yes you can get website templates and software to do it for you, but in the end like craig said it`s the content that matters. it`s usually the content part that is the most challenging. anyone can make a website pretty.

-------------------------

No Eternal Reward Will Forgive Us Now for Wasting the Dawn.

While content does matter, I tend to be more interested in graphics and colors.  The pics have to be top notch.  I`m easily sold with a good picture that speaks to me.  When I go grocery shopping I tend to buy things that are eye catching.  I don`t read for fat or carbs or organic or free range this and that.  If it looks good I grab it.  For instance, who would buy Hunts spaghetti sauce when a bottle of Mezzetta is so much better looking? 

-------------------------

Travis Tschepen
Hibachi Bros. LLC

--My goal in life is to be as good of a person my dog already thinks I am.--

nothing,
As a developer, I usually offer a full package. Domain Name registration, web hosting, and a fully functioning web site.
as far as the web site specs. Doesn`t matter whether it`s a simple web site or an application, I charge accordingly. I have a basic package that I charge and then depending on the add-ons that the customer wants is what the final cost is. Makes things much easier than quoting the whole project. Example: basic web site I would start at 600.00 for 5 pages, then if they want forms, flash headers, flash banners, and additional pages then I would charge individually. Most customers pay up to 1500 to 2000 for the whole web site.

Before I had a different approach, I would ask the customer for what they needed, and then just quote them for the whole project. What I noticed was that sometimes they would wait till they got quoted and then they would start with: I want this, this, this, and this.

Sometimes, I would have to take the loss. Now, Everytime they say I want this or this, I simply check the box that has the price and description of work. I call it my web customization specs sheet.
It keeps things simpler and at the same time let`s my customer know what those are extra features and that there is a price associated with it.

Example: Login and DB programming: $700.00 extra, Forms: $35.99 + $15.00 each addtional form, Flash Intros: $175.00 for full flash intro, Flash headers: 125.00 and so forth.
So even though they started at $600.00 base price, the project can grow both in price and page wise.


-------------------------

Edgar Monroy
Web Developer / Owner / Consultant
When starting your own business the need to "know-how" is greater than money!
http://www.nuevolution.net

I think that yes, you can do it yourself and use a template ... but it`s not very good branding.

The reason why you need more than frontend is because you need some of the technology on the back to make it better. Even if it`s just collecting visitor information or tracking campaigns ... you need to know some programming.

I have a wide range of clients with different needs. The question is not when they contact you, but what are you going to provide to help them with their needs? When a small business finally finds one webdev, they don`t want to have to call and find another to do their backend. They want one place to do it, but they don`t want to pay for design house prices. And that`s how it works.

As a side note, I find "nothing like it" to be somewhat negative. All sites follow some sort of standards for usability ... if you are reinventing the wheel, won`t you alienate the incoming traffic?

Amen to Nikole, "yes you can use a template but its not very good branding"
Templates are an easy way to advertise your business on the internet, Templates are more of a "HEY IM OPEN FOR BUSINESS" sorda thing.

What you have to keep in mind is; your web site`s going to grow with your company. The more people visit your web site, the more content you`re going to have to add. It`s the content and the usefullness of your content (website) that keeps your customers coming back.
Which mean you`re going to have to keep up with the demand, keeping up with the demand means having a web site that takes seconds to update. Not hours... with a template that`s what you are going to run  into. Hours and hours of development time. Why? most templates are made to handle the basic content and what your company is about. The minute you start messing around with the tables, and stuff like that they collapse.

Meaning, what should have been a 10 minute content update turns to hours trying to figure out what tables to touch and which tables you can`t even touch. So having a web site designed specifically for your company is the way to go. You might pay more in the begining to have it developed, but in the long run you are saving money.
So being able to offer your customers good development from the begining is your key to "surviving in this business"... 

-------------------------

Edgar Monroy
Web Developer / Owner / Consultant
When starting your own business the need to "know-how" is greater than money!
http://www.nuevolution.net

I like what you guys are saying, but I`ve been reading lots of stuff about how to create a position for yourself in your market. I`ve found a niche with my game development position. I`m having trouble pinpointing one with web design/development. I`m hearing two schools of thought:

1) Be different: Find you niche and your position and it will be easier to compete
2) Be a one stop shop because that`s what the customers want.

The latter seems to work well outside the web/tech services field.

But I kind of agree with option 2. I mean if I`m Joe Business Owner and know nothing of the web I don`t want to hire a graphic designer, a web designer and a web programmer from 3 different places. That said.

How do you cut through the chaff? In other words how do you communicate how different you are than the web designer down the street. Especially to a small business owner who may not care when he opens the phone book to "designers"?

I did notice something similar to what Craig was saying when i was working with my first few customers. They knew they wanted their websites to do something. They just didn`t know what or how. So it fell on my shoulders to do it. I`m not sure how to qualify this as a business strategic position though.

It`s true what you folks said about the templates. They`re really sophisticated but they seem to be missing a certain personality. I came up with a good dig against the use of templates for a website. "You wouldn`t wanna be caught wearing the same dress at a party? So why risk someone having the same site as you"

Not sure how good that is yet. Probably wouldn`t work for male users so much.


-------------------------

Follow the journey of Marvin Hawkins Visual Concepts and Nothing Like It Games at http://gamerdeveloper.blogspot.com/

Think that is a niche that is screaming to be addressed. A good website developer/programmer ought to think about starting a consulting business on this. His/her offer would be

"Before you hire a website developer talk to us, we will examine his prior work, what he/she charged for it, and if the customer got a good or bad deal"
Then you would go on with a list of the things developers look at and evaluate his prior work on a 0-10 scale

Copy	7	(original content)
Design	5	(neutral not targeted)
SEO	9	(likely to soar in search engines)
SEM	8	(geared to only one search engine)
Value	4	(slightly overpriced)
and so on..

That would be a way to buy peace of mind before a potential customer was to hire a developer. If they are to hire a developer for $5,000  having another professional developer examine his work and fees for a modest amount say $100 would be well worth the investment.

Eli