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What type of R O I are people expecting to get when buying a business

 
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Igor

posts: 9

Oct 31, 2006 10:28 PM ET    Quote  Report Abuse
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Maybe I dont understand enought but when I look to buy a business I look for something that will pay for itself in at least 1 year  but im shooting to double my investment within a year. Not talking about sales I want to pay it off with the profits made, am I being unrealistic with my plan or is this what everyone is looking for.   



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Customers dont care how much you know, unless they know how much you care first
Oct 31, 2006 11:12 PM ET    Quote  Report Abuse
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HMMM  at first glance  I would say yes. 

For you to realize a 100% or better rate of return you are going to realize  huge amounts of risk.  You have to realize the premise that risk equals higher returns.

Take junk bonds (very high risk bonds), they pay what???   20-30%  these are investment vehicles that have a very high perception of risk , the investment community says , based on the financial stability of the business "I might not get paid my money" and  you want to make 4 times that amount.  in a  word  WOW

Think of it this way, if you owned a business and it was profiting 100,000$ a year would you want to sell it for 100,000$.  I wouldnt  and I personally don`t know anybody that would.

I could pay someone 30-50,000 a year to operate it for me (assuming that the 100,000$ hadn`t already paid for such an employyee) and  I would still make 50-70,000$ a year  every year after that (assuming all other factors are equal, meaning that the business stay constant regards to profitability)  Every year you get 50,000 to have someone operate the business for you,  then why would you want to take a lump sum of 100,000$.  So if you and I wouldn`t do it then why in the world would anyone else want to.

If someone offered you a deal that had that potential (unless you had something that would make the business grow exponentially from your efforts) I would think long and hard to figure out what the risk was,  are the numbers inflated.  are all the sales and profits going to leave the company when the owners leaves  for what ever reason.

There is a formula to calculate the value of a business based on it profitability.  paritally based on growth potential.  Im only giving an educated guess and it dooesnt include other variables like assets.  If a business is profiting 100,000$ I would expect to have to pay between 500,000 and a million dollars which is 5 to 10 times the amount that you are wishing to be able to purchase it for.

Only estimates, please to try barbecue me if I`m off 100,000$ or two  LOL

mike

asykes

posts: 44

Nov 01, 2006 7:11 AM ET    Quote  Report Abuse
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I`d second that, it`s possible, but of course you have to consider how many times you`ll just lose your investment before you find one that acheives your criteria.

Think about the average return on multiple investments rather than the ROI for each individual investment.

Remember good defensive investing involves building a portfolio not taking a single punt. Even with an apparent "sure thing", you`re exposing yourself to more risk if you don`t spread your investment.


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Read About Double Entry Accounting & The Accounting Equation
MNGrillGuy

posts: 236

Nov 01, 2006 9:01 AM ET    Quote  Report Abuse
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I would agree with IdeasandInnovations.  A PE of 5-10 would seem reasonable.  Every industry has a different PE that values the business.  Low growth = low PE, high growth = high PE.  Best to learn what is appropriate for the business you are looking at. 

The goal is to pay a fair price and then add value by operating the business differently to increase the value of the business.   New customers, products, operating processes etc.   Even changing capitalization structure can alter the value of the business, although some will argue against that. 



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Travis Tschepen
Hibachi Bros. LLC

--My goal in life is to be as good of a person my dog already thinks I am.--
Igor

posts: 9

Nov 01, 2006 7:53 PM ET    Quote  Report Abuse
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I think the reason im looking for high returns is that servcie business with little equipment and home based dont bring high of an asking price. Example would be a mobile truck wash that I looked at with 158k in sales 1ft and 1pt employe and owner managed about 5 hours a week  very little expenses no overhead (its mobile) cash flow about 110,000  and the owner was asking 60k  30k and he would finance the rest, of course it got snatched from me before I finished doing my research on the industry but oh well.

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Customers dont care how much you know, unless they know how much you care first
MNGrillGuy

posts: 236

Nov 02, 2006 10:07 AM ET    Quote  Report Abuse
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Cash flowed $110K per year, selling for $60K.  Wow, that would have been like winning the lottery.  Probably good that you passed on it.  Something is fishy about that.   

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Travis Tschepen
Hibachi Bros. LLC

--My goal in life is to be as good of a person my dog already thinks I am.--
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