Forums: Discussions for entrepreneurs and small business.

There is nothing new in marketing right now. There is nothing in the base psychology of marketing that you can`t find in a textbook from years ago. It may be applied to a new medium, but it is not a new concept.

This is the benefit of education and/or the benefit of working for someone else for a while. You get to learn from some people who have been around and know the foundations of marketing. And a foundation is what you are missing here - you are creating a proposal that consists of a bag of tactics, and you don`t seem to realize the problem here.

Small business owners have a great deal of trust in vendors/contractors. A great deal of trust. They rely on you to steer them in the right direction. And unfortunately some have not been treated in a trustworthy manner. It is very difficult for me to have to tell a client that the $2K website they just bought 6 months ago is useless for their marketing purposes. This is a very uncomfortable conversation! And yet, this is the end result of using a bag of tactics and "taking a stab" at the problem when you don`t fully well know what you are doing. In the end, the owner is left with a project that either didn`t work or (worse yet) was harmful to the company ... and there is no way in hell they are going to recommend you to someone else after their own poor results.

You would honor your client`s time, money, and hard work by working with them to create a true marketing strategy from the get-go. If you don`t know marketing strategy, don`t toss a bunch of tactics at the problem ... work with someone else you can learn from, do some core research, or something. Your clients trust you, so don`t blow that relationship by not being able to help them with the big picture of their business (or at least being able to bring in someone who can).

There are some things you can get away with under JoeJustin`s summary ... such as, perhaps a programmer knows CFM better than PHP, yet bids a PHP project anyway. This can be picked up on the fly if someone already knows other programming languages.

But the ability to create a marketing strategy and a be a big-picture thinker ... this comes with time, experience and knowledge. This is not something you want to just take a stab at, when people are trusting you and their livelihood depends on it. A failed campaign doesn`t just mean that marketing budget blown ... it means that the company has not brought in projected revenue during that time period -- a cash flow situation that could very well destroy a new business in as little as 6 months.

As an example of all this, these questions can not be answered:
* What tactics can I use to increase word-of-mouth referrals?
* Would an email marketing campaign be useful? How?
You have jumped straight into the middle of the marketing plan instead of at the  beginning. The beginning starts with the business plan and the target market; runs through a systematic approach for identifying, planning for, and tackling each target market; and lands squarely in a system to identifying the effectiveness of the marketing efforts.

I don`t think I am entirely unique in my holistic view of marketing ... but I do think it`s something we need more of lately.

I know I have come down particularly hard on this post ... but it is probably because your services overlap with mine so I take particular interest in the topic. You are also coming here to ask for help with your clients ... not a business owner coming here for help with their own marketing goals or website. I feel it would be a disservice to simply do your job for you. Instead, I feel like I am doing my job better if I point you in the right direction. It makes my industry better as a whole if we simply all stop throwing a bag of tactics at complicated problems.

Okay, Nikole, I partly agree with your views above. I agree with your holistic view of marketing. Every project is different, and  a marketer would do well with a basic grip on all the P`s and experience of the play of those Ps in varied and different markets.New business strategy is a BIG responsbility, especially for a small budget venture. But, its tricky as one of the money saving tactics is to seek help from half-baked cost-effective marketers( I am NOT calling you that DAVID).

On the `throwing a bag of tactics` bit, I reckon we are here in the forum to brainstorm ideas and not to write a step by step strategic plan for a multinational firm. All marketers need to fill in some grey areas in their plan from time to time, I use such forums to get inspired ideas and get a varied view on a problem which might be too close to me to act fairly upon. Its upto me then whether to analyse how well the tips and tactics given fit in my overall big picture, or, to read them lightly, but no harm in bouncing ideas around.

 

You don`t have to be a `multinational firm` to have a need for a good marketing strategy. And if I tell my clients to just do this or this or this without knowing their strategy is in place, then I am not doing my job. It doesn`t have to be a specific "let`s sit down and outline your strategy" ... but I at least need to know what the market they are currently trying to tackle is; otherwise, how am I going to know what will be effective?

A web site shouldn`t just be a website. It should be a part of the greater whole - a reflection of the company`s overall strategies.

whoa, looks like i touched a nerve with my posting. if anything this just
show the passion of the startupnation community. that`s really awesome.

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David Wang
Chief WordPress Wrangler @ ClickWP

Nikole, two things: You advocated a `big picture` scenario and you yourself took my sentences out of context. A `multinational firm`s` marketing strategy is fairly different from a small individual start up. Okay you can argue that the basics are all the same. But its a difference similar to driving a Formula One car and a small Vauxhall 1.2. You have to agree that new entrepreneurs do not have a comprehensive marketing strategy all written down.Whether they should be doing it more often is open to debate. I know it, as I have worked with a few new starters.. To be honest all they have is a simple plan  and a `bag of tactics` to play around. They dn`t have time, or, research money , or  access to expertise to jot down proven  strategies. Besides, I said that we are in the FORUM to share ideas and not to guide each other step by step, that doesn`t mean I discarded the need of a detailed strategic plan.
 `A website shouldn`t just be a website`, what about affiliate marketers or complete web based businesses? Their website is at the fore front of their planning. Its their focal point and not just a part of the whole. Try teaching them  the strategic marketing planning and they would keep coming back with questions to increase the traffic first.
David, I dn`t know why we are arguing. I am strongly opposed to the idea of presenting STRONG views and opinions rejecting every one`s else`s say.

I was going to stay away from this one all together.  However, I must point out that maybe to YOU, there is nothing new in the market right now.  WEB 2.0 and all the things that go into it is new to most folks.  Yes, a lot of people have heard the term.  Yes a lot of people know that this is all that blogging and social marketing stuff.  Yes, It may work but I don`t want to get involved in myspace and facebook.

Those are the typical responses you get from folks who don`t know what WEB 2.0 can do.  As professional we should be telling folks what it can do. 

How many of you know that if you use WEB 2.0 marketing, you can acheive 6 or 10 placements within the first 20 on Google?  This can be accomplished if done properly.  Now I am not going to tell everyone how to do this.  Bu tit can be accomplished on a consistant basis, even with highly competive keytwords.

What does this mean to ALL businesses.  Well, there is a new type of marketing out there.  When you achieve multiple placements on the first two pages of Google, you really don`t have to worry as much if your number one ranking goes to say number three.  Because you still have a lot in the top 20.

That`s just my two cents.


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Arsenal Marketing
WEB 2.0 Internet Marketing for Business
http://www.arsenalmarketing.com
Joe@arsenalmarketing.com

Reach a larger audience!
Start blogging today!
Using WEB 2.0 strategies & techniques!

Joe, Web 2.0 might be a great buzzword, but it`s the same psychology and principles that were out there 10 years ago. That was my point. Your medium has changed but the basics have not.

Hersh, when you treat the site as a whole and don`t steer a client towards the greater picture, you limit their success in life. I feel it`s my job to not just help them with the now, but to always help them see down the road as well. They do have "access to expertise" ... that is why they are paying me! And I would not be doing my job if I just tossed up something because they wanted it that way.

I know my opinions may be a little strong on this, but it`s frustrating to see the number of redesigns I have to do from poor planning in the first place. Planning doesn`t have to take large amounts of time ... but it will when you don`t plan in the first place. Then your site will end up 2x as expensive as it should have been.

Nichole,
I am sorry to tell you that WEB 2.0 is not just a "Buzz" word.  I guess I assumed you knew what WEB 2.0 was all about.  The whole idea is to let users generate content for your site and/or social sites.  This is a totally new marketing conept that a lot of folks still don`t know about.   As I mentioned in my previous message, everyone thinks that it`s just blogging and mypsace and they couldn`t be farther fom the truth. 

It was the topic of discussion at the last Gartner Summit.  They even discussed how th firing of all the so called troubled customers that sprint recently fired, will not work in the neear future, becuase of WEB 2.0. 

If you take a look at my blog there is evidence of that already. I signed up for an MLM that was touting to be the next myspace.  I signed up and then recieved multiple spam emails on a daily basis.  The never provided an opt-out for their list and every time I sent them an email, I received the spam on the next day from a different person.  So I posted a couple of articles about their company and them being spammers. 

Well guess what?  After three days and two posts the CEO of company came to my site publicly admitted their oversight and apologized.  Only then did they take me off of their emil list.  This would not have happened had it not been for WEB 2.0. 

I am here to tell you that WEB 2.0 is here to stay!  It`s time for you to do your research and start to use it!


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Arsenal Marketing
WEB 2.0 Internet Marketing for Business
http://www.arsenalmarketing.com
Joe@arsenalmarketing.com

Reach a larger audience!
Start blogging today!
Using WEB 2.0 strategies & techniques!

This was not a comment on "Web 2.0" ... which yes, is a buzz word that was coined by someone at some point.

The point is that social marketing is the same. People are the same. The thing that has changed is the MEDIUM. As I said too many times already!

Psychology - same. Marketing principles - same. Medium - different.

Maybe w should make WEB 2.0 another topic for a post.  Because it`s obvious that even you don`t understand what it is.  

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Arsenal Marketing
WEB 2.0 Internet Marketing for Business
http://www.arsenalmarketing.com
Joe@arsenalmarketing.com

Reach a larger audience!
Start blogging today!
Using WEB 2.0 strategies & techniques!