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Bartering and taxes

 
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jcraig0713

posts: 2

Mar 08, 2007 9:30 PM ET    Quote  Report Abuse
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If for a service, I would have normally charged 6000 and the person offered the choice of cash or a vehicle listed for sale at 7999 (blue book 3675 to 7925) as he owns a car dealership and did not provide a 1099 what tax effect would that have for me to claim income as?  This is essentially a barter situation.  I think I woul dhave to claim the 6000 (up to the charge of the service) as income?  Does anyone have any insight?
CraigL

posts: 9051

Mar 09, 2007 1:14 AM ET    Quote  Report Abuse
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:-) I`m wondering if the words "gray market" apply here? How about "lobbyist?"

What about, "What the IRS doesn`t know, can`t hurt me."

I`m not a lawyer, and don`t play one on the phone.

ElidS

posts: 471

Mar 09, 2007 11:59 AM ET    Quote  Report Abuse
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From the SCORE site
 

Barter transactions can provide your company with important financial, sales and marketing benefits. Like other transactions, however, barter sales are taxable, and your company must report them to the IRS. This is also true of credits you receive or spend through a barter exchange; regardless of how you use barter credits, they are taxable as though they were cash.

Barter Income and the IRS
The U.S. government considers barter exchanges to be legal third-party record keepers, similar to banks, brokerages and other firms that deal with taxpayer records. Barter exchanges are required to complete and submit Form 1099-B, "Proceeds from Broker and Barter Exchange Transactions," for each of their members and the IRS. In order for the exchange to complete this form, you`ll need to give the broker your taxpayer identification number.

As far as the IRS is concerned, barter dollars are identical to real dollars. As a result, you won`t get any special tax benefits (or penalties, for that matter) from using a barter exchange. If you conduct any direct barter — that is, barter for another company`s products or services — you`ll have to declare the fair market value of the items you sold as taxable income.

This same-as-cash standard also applies to barter purchases: If a barter purchase is business-related, you can deduct it from your taxes, but if it`s for personal use you can`t deduct it.


jcraig0713

posts: 2

Mar 09, 2007 1:38 PM ET    Quote  Report Abuse
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Thanks so much for replying!

So if I chose the car in exchange for payment of my services, I need to claim the FMV of the item received.  In this case the car.  So if the sale price was 7999 and the blue book value is presented in a range 3675 to 7925, wghat is the amount I need to claim as income?

CraigL

posts: 9051

Mar 10, 2007 1:23 AM ET    Quote  Report Abuse
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Talk to a tax accountant.

Think of those folks who win a car or a boat in a contest. They have to pay taxes on the value of the prize, right? So it comes down to how ethical do you want to be in relation to the IRS, and if you decide to pay the taxes, getting a good tax specialist. They`ll have the number right away.
ElidS

posts: 471

Mar 10, 2007 3:19 PM ET    Quote  Report Abuse
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Yes that is something that your accountant should take care off. But if the questions is for general knowledge purposes only then the answer is in that quote above

"you`ll have to declare the fair market value of the items you sold as taxable income. "

CraigL

posts: 9051

Mar 11, 2007 1:40 AM ET    Quote  Report Abuse
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Thinking about it, this isn`t actually a "fair market value" problem, I`m guessing. Remember, I`m not a lawyer or tax accountant. But isn`t this car being given in exchange for work completed? In that case, isn`t the value of the car being declared equal to the billable rate for the work?
ElidS

posts: 471

Mar 11, 2007 12:38 PM ET    Quote  Report Abuse
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isn`t this car being given in exchange for work completed? In that case, isn`t the value of the car being declared equal to the billable rate for the work?


huh! interesting question.

Of course this is all academics, since admittedly neither of us knows for sure, but... Lets say you sell me a brand new convertible Bentley Continental GT for a quarter (it could happen) would that mean that the Bentley is worth a quarter, or that the value of that quarter is $160k?

My guess is that for tax purposes the value of the property being sold would remain at $160k and I`d have to pay that 8.5% of 160k in luxury tax. So, from this point of view the value of what is being sold is what determines the tax liability.


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